T.B.O.F. - Indiana Traditional Bowhunters Association

bambi · Guru

T.B.O.F.

Redtail · Senior Member

Dennis,

We got down there Thursday afternoon. Froze our butt off that night but..... after that the weather was perfect. Dale got a new tent so he didn't have to worry about that. They had a lot of vendors, so we each spent money on things we "thought" we needed (re-loaded with plenty of carbons).

Ron Denton did have a chance to tell his Montana Bigfoot story. And.... I don't know anything about smoked mullet.

Steve

Redtail · Senior Member

Met a fella down there from Ga. About 6ft5. Shoots a 90 pd Black Widow. They gave it to him because he broke 2 other Widows. He has to shoot fishing arrows out of it to be stiff and heavy enough. Wouldn't want to make this guy mad.

Made me feel like I'm shooting a kids bow. Says the poundage doesn't bother him. Shoots about 50 shots before he notices the wieght..

catfishon · Guru

does he live in Montana ??? lol

bambi · Guru

That might have been one of Johns offspring weirdface

I'd hate to see the mother bleh

bambi · Guru

Just kiddin Mr. Nail. I'll bet she was pretty for a big girl ashamed

So how did the shootin go? Next big shoot is the Klassic biggrin

Redtail · Senior Member

The shooting went pretty good. The two courses set Sat were pretty hard. Sunday they moved the stakes and I thought it was a little easier. Dale still suffered a little from target panic and shot his 40lb bow because of his shoulder. Ron Denton is also having some shoulder issues but he shot ok. I got real lucky and shot the shoots high score. I was put into the recurve class because of the carbons. But...... One for split fingers and longboows. Right John? wink

bambi · Guru

flinttim · Guru

My hero !!!

randy grider · Guru

Ahh, seems like jusy yesterday when Redtail was condeming carbo arrows and all the evil they represent..., Our little man is growing up !

Redtail · Senior Member

Randy,

It was a tough conversion (was hoping you wouldn't see the carbon comment) but... I am out of the closet. I got very fustrated with wood, again, a couple of weeks ago as I tried to go back. I don't have the patience for them. 4 dozen nice tapered cedar arrows will go on the trade blanket this year. Bought two dozen new gold tip shafts in Florida this past weekend. I do want to do the wrap thing going forward, if I can find some cool ones.

Steve

randy grider · Guru

I understand, you are all about being cool .....

bambi · Guru

This carbon arrow stuff is spreading like the flu around here. doh

Arrows are made of wood, sticks, shoots, vines, and roots. Not petro-chemicals. Every time you buy a carbon, your helping rebuild sadams army. furious

I bet Ronald got that stuff started. Just like three under. DEN

john nail · Guru

carbon been around longer than wood.....If the big feller's eyes were r e a l close together, he might have been one 'O mine....

Congratulations, Steve! Longbows and split fingers. There oughta be a law... biggrin

-- Edited by john nail at 23:29, 2008-03-04

catfishon · Guru

good job steve !

randy grider · Guru

I shoot carbon because i'm a tightwad ! In the longrun they are cheaper. Hard to break, won't bend, you never shoot the spine out of 'em,more consistent (easily) easy to assemble,easy to weight, easy to change weights, penetration is outstanding, then you just hose the blood off and kill another deer with it.
Carbons used to be cost prohibitive, and still are if you let the sales pitch convince you to buy the "perfect" shaft, but even the goldtip blems are far more straight,and weight/spine matched than any wood you'll find.
Its no secret my accuracy is not up to par, Redtail is always willing to point this out, so I need all the help I can get !
I used to be a big wood arrow advocate, shot nothing else, but found it hard to find the time to keep a supply made up, due to breaking them.
I admire those that keep shooting them, as well as fellows that shoot selfbows, I can't do much with either.
In spite of all their good, I just can't make myself shoot anything but wood out of a selfbow, never even tried it the alternatives, it just seems WRONG !! smile

bambi · Guru

This is Dennis. Cheaper? Perhaps. That's why they appeal to Tim wink

Easier? I'll give you that. More accurate? Only in theory. I suppose they'll shoot ok out of a center cut bow. Better penetration? I'll try one if you'll tell me how to mount one of my trade points on it. biggrin

DEN

twigflicker · Guru

Well now...

It looks like Dennis may just be shooting a carbon soon...

Dennis, I saw on Tradgang once where they had taken a steel broadhead adapter and kerfed a slot in it to accept a trade point... I don't see why that couldn't be done with a long aluminum one as well... to help keep the weight down a bit...

Although... there just something about shooting wood out of a self bow... I'm with Randy G on that one... It's almost sacreligious to shoot carbon out of a self bow... that's just my old fart side coming out... and maybe why I've not shot a self bow in years...

Jonathan

bambi · Guru

Jon, I'll need a selfnock also. biggrin

randy grider · Guru

they are more accurate, and will shoot better out of a longbow too. you just have to weight the point end to weaken the spine enough. carbons are stiff, and to me way stiffer than there numbers indicate. the 35/55 goldtips need point weight added, or left reeeeal long to spine weak enough for a 55# bow, at least they do for me.
Keep in mind they are produced to cater to the majority, which is of course compounds. they want and need stiff spines being centershot, with lotsumph at the end of the powerstroke. recurves and longbows have the max draw weight at the beginning of the powerstroke.
You just have to adapt, it can be figured out, and its not rocket science. kinda fun to play around with them to see what works, once you get it you have an arrow that uot performs,outlasts, and in the longrun is cheaper than any other.
I have never broke one short of a direct hit by any arrow, or direct hit on something hard like a rock, or outside of the kill zone on elvis biggrin

I have bounced them off rocks with no ill effects, and worry none at all when they bounce off tree limbs,or another arrow. They are quiet in the quiver, and quiet shooting if weighted. If not weighted its the bow thats noisy, not the arrow. My weighted goldtips weigh around 550 grains, plenty for my 54# Predator recurve, they are quiet, and penetrate real good, even at my 26.5" draw, which cuts the poundage back to under 50#
They recover quickly,fly straight, and weigh heavy, and the small diameter all equal penetration.The smalll diameter also helps with picky longbows, tends to make them more centershot
The doe I took last fall took a wensel woodsmen on this arrow quartering away, it buried in the off side shoulder, other wise would have blown clean through. it looked like she'd taken a 12 gauge slug, she hosed the woods with a blood trail a blind man could fallow.
I used to use cedar,fir,birch, exclusively, and stubbornly refused to try carbon, or even aluminum,but never got the performance I get from these goldtips.
But to each his own, thats what makes the world go 'round

bambi · Guru

Randy, you've convinced me. I'm still not gonna shoot them, but I belive their better than wood arrows. I'd say about four times better idea

Ironically I won a dozen carbos at our banquet this year. I'm not sure what breed they are but they have some kinda stamp or serial number or something on them. I'll probaly put them on the trade blanket this year, and figure their probably worth about four dozen old fashioned tapered cedars. wink

Next time you come up to shoot remind me to show you my new fifety centavo ramin shafts. Their imported you know smile

It may just be a coincidence but since I've been making those up a lot of people have reported seeing deer swiming the Ohio, leaving Indiana. biggrin

DEN

john nail · Guru

how do you weight them? Mine finish out at exactly 500gr

flinttim · Guru

John, I used 7 " crown wraps, 5" shield cut fletches,left the shafts full length, the nocks and inserts Sipsey supplied and 125 gr points. Mine came in at 496 grs (one shaft out of the dozen weighed 497). Now I bought the Traditional Hunters and I think they are bit lighter than the ones you got. I tried 145 and 160 gr points but the arrows flew best with 125 . I did try 100 gr pts but think they are too light for the bow. All I can shoot in the backyard is about 15 yds,and if I shoot more than 4 or so at a time I start busting nocks. It's like they are riding a rail. That's out of my 55# recurve, I tried them in my 48# Saxon Curve and they flew good with 145 gr points but the added weight caused the arrows to drop more than I am used to and I don't want to learn to shoot all over again with that bow. I'll stick with the 1916 alum on that bow.
I plan to stick with wood on my longbow and selfbows but I got out all my arrows and shot them thru the longbow to sort the ones that flew best. Ones that did not fly well (note that all the arrows were spined to 50# plus or minus 5 gr) I sorted out and kept seperate. I did not just shoot them once but several times to be sure it was the arrows and not me. When I was done I weighed all the arrows to see if there was much difference. In one dozen I had made a couple of years ago, Port Orford Cedar, same fletches same points and same everything, there was a 70 gr spread from top to bottom. It's hard to belive that you could have that big a spread in what was supposed to be 12 shafts the same .Out of that dozen arrows I could get less than half to shoot in my bow.Bottom line is if you are going to use cedar you might as well go ahead and pay more for spined and weight sorted shafts.

catfishon · Guru

tim you can come down the road to my house and shoot . i can get 40 yds, and i'm out there everyday its not raining .

twigflicker · Guru

Hum... maybe a little wooden plug in the nock end... cut your nock in and viola!

Ha!

Jonathan

catfishon · Guru

john the brass inserts are the way to go for adding weight to them .
you can get 50gr or 100gr . my redwing and bighorn like 29" 35/55 with 175 gr points. both are 50# bows and the gold tips are just shy of 500gr.
i still shoot carbon some times but i just like the sound of a big ole ceder smacking the target.
my cedar also weigh about the same , not sure why they thump more when they hit the target but i like it....

randy grider · Guru

What John said, I use 100 gr brass inserts, and 125 gr tips, but cut my shafts 28" and they wind up around 550 Gr.
That way the are point heavy, and i can swap field points to broadheads with no tuning issues, and they weigh plenty heavy enough that with the small diameter they really sink in a 3-d target. I know we don't want to stick 'em deep in a 3-d, but they do good in bone and flesh as well, thats my goal, 3-d's are just practice.
You can also get all thread which can go in the back side of the insert and screw on weights that you can weight to you're hearts content. I have no experience with these though.
Its fun to play with, even if they are far, far inferior to bambi's discount reject ramin dowels from Lowes ! biggrin

Dennis lets put 'em on a grain scale and spinetester sometime. aww

Guess 'ol bambi is still opposed to that new fangled invention...., the wheel !
He said it is for carrying beer on ! wink

I guess if you are shooting selfbows, which he I think he is, i'll have to agree,woods the only way. Its neat to build you're own, hats off to him.
Dennis, you ever make shafts from scratch? By that I mean starting out with a plank, cutting to strips,planing, then sanding to round stock.
Keep up the good work.

randy grider · Guru

bambi wrote:

Next time you come up to shoot remind me to show you my new fifety centavo ramin shafts. Their imported you know It may just be a coincidence but since I've been making those up a lot of people have reported seeing deer swiming the Ohio, leaving Indiana. DEN

Imported ?! Here I thought you were an American !
You just keep herdin' the deer across the river into KY, we need some after our lengthy gun seasons and a bout of blue-tongue.
Just do us a favor and teach them some southern slang like "Ya'll, ain't, pert near, yonder, etc.," and forbid the further use of words like "you's guys, oh yah,mucky " and other sharp quick yankee tones that come out sounding like a cursing during normal conversation.

Just kidding of course.

bambi · Guru

This is Dennis. I have a high breed Bostonian accent, but can usually communicate with sign language with anyone. biggrin

bambi · Guru

I've made arrows out of a lot of different things. I like running boards thru the table saw and getting my fingers right near the blade wink

Thats fun. DEN